"Forgetting is not erasing who we are; it is seeing through the identification with the āIā ā the self entangled in the outside."
This is the difficult part to understand much less express. The distinctions among the various aspects of self are like a moving mobile in which grasping one part of it moves all the other parts and your action just changed everything.
One especially tricky part is dealing with this concept of the "I." My question, because I am unsure, is whether you are agreeing with those who say that the "I" is a Western concept that is foreign to Eastern philosophies like Daoism, or that the "I" is something else. If the latter, despite having been engaged with Daoist thought for a very long time, I am still confused by its varying descriptions of the "I" and the eternal self.
Thanks for sharing your insights, Douglas. I think there are indeed some nuanced differences regarding the notion of "I." The Taoist view of the self, based on my understanding of Chuang Tzu, is that the true self is one's spirit, that is at ease with one's spontaneous and natural state of existence, that is aware of the forces of external conditioning and the constraints of conventions. Spiritual autonomy in this sense is to be one with one's natural self.
This true person (as Chuang Tzu would call it) is just a tiny part of the myriad things in the world. So forgetting is seeing through the limits of the ego, seeing the smallness of the "I" in the holistic oneness. I think this is where Taoism and the Western notion of the "I" can differ a bit, despite sharing a common attitude of reevaluating everything in the existing, actual world.
Following! Particularly appreciate your comment here. The word nuances is something I'm wrestling with lately. Same word means so differently across languages, cultural constructs, and at the individual basis. I'm finding similar issues in the Zen world - general Western perception of it as meditation, wellness (for personal cultivation) vs how it actually is practiced in everyday life in Japan even if they don't claim to be 'Zen' (much more communally).
Thank you; following back. There are so many differences between Western culture and language and East Asian culture and language. I barely understand them. What you say about the perception of meditation in distinction from understanding everyday practice is a great insight. I think itās a product of modern Western culture, which some people blame on capitalism, but whatever the cause, Westerners have a cultural mindset that clouds them from understanding anything in terms of holistic life practice.
Thanks, Douglas. And thanks Yuxuan for his response which shows great depth. Will continue to think about this for sure! The two streams Yuxuan indicated may be a bit similar to how I see Zen: (1) There's the practical path of practice of what we do every with ourselves and for others - ę äøŗčŖē¶, spontaneous and natural and that includes the good and bad in ourselves. (2) Much larger non-separateness unfolding of all experience at each and every moment, i.e. Buddha nature.
In Xuanzang's "Cheng Wei-Shi Lun," (Demonstrations of Consciousness Only) the two main illusions are the self and the objects after which the self grasps. š²āøļøš²
I am most grateful for this article. Thank you. So much wisdom. That simple wisdom so hard to find. Thank you again. I will certainly come back and re-read it carefully.
Chuang Tzu depicts the Perfect Person as having no self.ā- I Love this! Great post. I was just reflecting this morning on how the people who suffer the most and have the most drama going on are the people most heavily invested in āthemselvesā. Hereās to forgetting!!!
It's great you're feeling your way through your inner compass! Reminds me of the spirit of 'returning' in Taoism that we can find in tea, similar to Zen and Shintoism. Beneath grasping and thought, we will find our pure, original heart-mind as it always has been. Beneath the clouds, the blue sky that has always been present.
Beautiful. Thank you for sharing. I struggle to get out of the rushing and ruminative thoughts in my head when I reach for stillness and meditation. Itās a constant but worthy struggle.
"Forgetting is not erasing who we are; it is seeing through the identification with the āIā ā the self entangled in the outside."
This is the difficult part to understand much less express. The distinctions among the various aspects of self are like a moving mobile in which grasping one part of it moves all the other parts and your action just changed everything.
One especially tricky part is dealing with this concept of the "I." My question, because I am unsure, is whether you are agreeing with those who say that the "I" is a Western concept that is foreign to Eastern philosophies like Daoism, or that the "I" is something else. If the latter, despite having been engaged with Daoist thought for a very long time, I am still confused by its varying descriptions of the "I" and the eternal self.
Thanks for sharing your insights, Douglas. I think there are indeed some nuanced differences regarding the notion of "I." The Taoist view of the self, based on my understanding of Chuang Tzu, is that the true self is one's spirit, that is at ease with one's spontaneous and natural state of existence, that is aware of the forces of external conditioning and the constraints of conventions. Spiritual autonomy in this sense is to be one with one's natural self.
This true person (as Chuang Tzu would call it) is just a tiny part of the myriad things in the world. So forgetting is seeing through the limits of the ego, seeing the smallness of the "I" in the holistic oneness. I think this is where Taoism and the Western notion of the "I" can differ a bit, despite sharing a common attitude of reevaluating everything in the existing, actual world.
Thank you, I like your description very much and it is helpful.
Following! Particularly appreciate your comment here. The word nuances is something I'm wrestling with lately. Same word means so differently across languages, cultural constructs, and at the individual basis. I'm finding similar issues in the Zen world - general Western perception of it as meditation, wellness (for personal cultivation) vs how it actually is practiced in everyday life in Japan even if they don't claim to be 'Zen' (much more communally).
Thank you; following back. There are so many differences between Western culture and language and East Asian culture and language. I barely understand them. What you say about the perception of meditation in distinction from understanding everyday practice is a great insight. I think itās a product of modern Western culture, which some people blame on capitalism, but whatever the cause, Westerners have a cultural mindset that clouds them from understanding anything in terms of holistic life practice.
Thanks, Douglas. And thanks Yuxuan for his response which shows great depth. Will continue to think about this for sure! The two streams Yuxuan indicated may be a bit similar to how I see Zen: (1) There's the practical path of practice of what we do every with ourselves and for others - ę äøŗčŖē¶, spontaneous and natural and that includes the good and bad in ourselves. (2) Much larger non-separateness unfolding of all experience at each and every moment, i.e. Buddha nature.
In Xuanzang's "Cheng Wei-Shi Lun," (Demonstrations of Consciousness Only) the two main illusions are the self and the objects after which the self grasps. š²āøļøš²
Really like this insight from Xuanzang! Thanks for sharing! š
Excellent essay. Many thanks š.
Thanks Leon!
I am most grateful for this article. Thank you. So much wisdom. That simple wisdom so hard to find. Thank you again. I will certainly come back and re-read it carefully.
Thanks you! I'm really glad you find this post useful!
Chuang Tzu depicts the Perfect Person as having no self.ā- I Love this! Great post. I was just reflecting this morning on how the people who suffer the most and have the most drama going on are the people most heavily invested in āthemselvesā. Hereās to forgetting!!!
Thanks so much Christoph. Such a coincidence! Living lightly with forgetting.
It's great you're feeling your way through your inner compass! Reminds me of the spirit of 'returning' in Taoism that we can find in tea, similar to Zen and Shintoism. Beneath grasping and thought, we will find our pure, original heart-mind as it always has been. Beneath the clouds, the blue sky that has always been present.
Thanks Peckgee. I feel it's really a constant practice of fine-tuning the inner compass! Need more time to stay in nature, to feel myself.
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Beautiful. Thank you for sharing. I struggle to get out of the rushing and ruminative thoughts in my head when I reach for stillness and meditation. Itās a constant but worthy struggle.
Thanks Timothy! Glad this is useful!